Dear All
thanks for the comments
Wayne and Ezri wrote: Salman wrote:
we have issues that masters use not only CKR, but SHK and HSZSN,however latently, in level one iniitations... with a 'programming' that SHK and HSZSN will not be availabe to student on conscious level, unless he becomes 'entitled' to it via level 2 initiations...
Wayne : There's a question, as to what's the purpose of initiating a level 1 student into symbols they're supposedely not using.
Ezri : Perhaps it depends on the nature of the initiation ritual a particular person uses.
Not all initiation rituals use all the symbols at all levels, this we are taught was how it was before Takata's passing. And I think that in the past there was more secrecy about Reiki, people did not discuss it in public, so even if a student was initiated with the three symbols, they would not know that they had, and would not know about how and why and when to use them. "Entitlement" would come with instruction in their nature and methods of application
"The practice 'handed down' to us after Takata Sensei was perhaps to not to use all symbols for all levels..." but that later changed and some of the masters started adding up their personal flavours to the initiation, for sake of 'securing' a better initiation, plus with a taste for experimentation, i dunno, but a big question rises for me here...reiki in those days was considered far more 'sacred' (and 'secret' too ) than we have these days.. how some of the masters had actually 'dared' started using all the three symbols right from level one?
if i m initiated into a system that is primarily initiation-based, from how and where i get a 'mandate' of start doing things that don't tie up (or atleast precedented) by the lineage holders up my ladder...
this is a big question, for me, at least, that if i m going to add up something to an initiation-based system, i might be doing a great disservice to all that follow me down the ladder..
for me its more of a question of 'how dare you' instead of 'how/why do you' ?
on a different note, could be a possibility that some masters may assume that since they dont actually know what 'exactly' was passed down by Takata Sensei, or that what possibly was shared with her by Hayashi Sensei, they feel it their 'right' to add whatever they feel benefecial to their practices, taking a self-assumed 'benefit of doubt' ??
Wayne and Ezri wrote: Salman wrote:
What is the 'real' rationale of splitting initiations between level one and level two ( i'm not asking about 'effects', i'm talking about 'rationale' )
Wayne : There's the training, the knowledge of these symbols and their uses. Then there's the actual initiation, the spiritual empowerment to use the symbols. The spiritual empowerment to use the symbols is meant to be at a later time than the initial ability to experience Reiki. This is cause a person can build up their relationship with Reiki gradually.
and this is important cause Reiki was meant to be a great responsibility. Highly valued.
Ezri : IMO,to give the student the necessary space to develop firm foundations in the tactile application of energy-centred bodywork.
if this was the real 'wisdom' behind split of level one and two (i feel agreed too
) then do we have to ask ourselves then why we dont adopt the system of reiju and extensive sessions of giving treatments to potential students, before we would initiate them to level one....
mostly its upto the masters that how they see they would shape up the impression of reiki community by attuning 'batches' of 'batches' of students.... reiki is highly valued, highly sacred (even when it is nowadays not so secret)... and this is something a master knows much better than a potential student.... do we have a 'code of ethics' specifically written and accepted globally so that masters would be aware that they attune the right candidate only after they had some experience with them through reiju and/or personally knowing and/or giving treatment sessions...
the point i want to make is that instead of producing hundreds of 'useless' students, it is perhaps better to produce 'just a couple of good students... this decision is based on the conscience of the master in the first instance, but do we have any detailed literature available for masters to come up to such concsience ??
Wayne wrote: Salman wrote:
its not that i m doing away with importance of symbols in level 2, rather i m saying that how can we 'know' that symbols were not there in level one ????? and so, again to the question, how a master can say he 'controls' not passing on symbols when he intends to initiate somebody with level one, with clear intention that he is 'not' initiating him to level 2..
The master can't control it sometimes. It depends on how the symbols are used in level 1 initiation. The teacher may think they' only intiating in level 1, but depending on what way they use the symbols, quite often, they're also initiating right up to master level. This is why level 1 students can sometimes think that they can absent healing in Reiki, or initiaite themselves or others.
ah, Wayne dont you see this to be too pathetic for a master that he does not 'know' what he was exactly doing in an initiation... no disrespect intended, but i m just trying to see the whole episode with a neutral mind... a master has a great responsiblity, imo, he is 'tampering' with the spirituality of a student, and if he is not adquately aware of what he is doing, that may have unpleasant results for the student...
'throwing all the symbols in all the chakras of the student' and selectively programming some or one of them to be active, and others to be dormant till the next level' might not be an ideal practice always... i mean to say... what if a master had some sessions with students giving them reiju, giving them an appetite for the reiki feeling, and then gradually initiating them to level one... and so on...
any thought on this Wayne
??
Ezri wrote: Salman wrote:
post script : when i google mastership within reiki, i also come across terms like level 3a and 3b... what is meant by that ?? initiating somebody with master symbol but not conferring him initiating ability in so-called level 3a ? if we initiate somebdoy with master symbol but dont give him power to initiate people onwards, what we are initiating him with when initiating with master symbol ??
After Takata's passing some masters decided to split the master level in two parts.
I heard that the people doing this believed that the master level initiation gave you more "power". In part one the student would receive the master initiation and the expected boost in power. So really this was considered like an advanced or powered-up level 2. The student was not taught the initiation rituals, and was not taught how to draw the master symbol, or taught its mantra. This was only taught in the part two master training. It was not that the student was not given the power to initiate, it was only that the student was not instructed in the method of initiating which was kept for part two. I suppose the need for part two is obsolete now with all the information on different ways of initiating you can find on the internet
agreed that part b seems to be sorta 'obsolete' now, given today's internet age, but even before that, there seems to be more of an 'ego-trip' on the part of masters to split up level 3 between 'a' and 'b' than the wisdom you just quoted... (sorry, if that is offensive to say) but honestly seeing, if i m initiating someone to such a high level as mastership, then dont i need to pre confirm myself that is that buddy 'ready' for that ?
not an arguement-biting dear Ezri
, just curious so that i have a logic for what i do next
!
Ezri wrote: Salman wrote:
secondly, there is a view that DKM contains aspects of all the three levels combined... is that true ? and if true, then why dont masters use just DKM while initiating people in level one, and level two, since it already has aspects of CKR, SHK and HSZSN combined !
I know there have been people claim the Master Symbol contains the aspects or qualities of all three other symbols combined, but this is IMO just another invention plucked out of thin air.
It is taught that before people began personalising the rituals of initiation, the master symbol and its mantra was only to be used for initiating masters
and if i'wd be among those who wish to further do such a thin-capitalization, i would rather like to introduce HSZSN even before CKR and SHK, since once we start pouring in our own logics to a system like reiki, then there is virtually no end
personally, i feel DKM is 'specific' in its use for initiations... and even if it has subsidiary effects like 'power boost up' we rather have to stick to its primary purpose, just to save us from meaningless confusions....
i would be interested to hear the logics of people who have an oppoiste view for DKM
Renu wrote: there are people here in india who teach all three levels in a span of two-three days. thereafter, most of the students do not practise reiki or if they want to, they look around for some reiki master who can explain things to them. since their teacher does not explain or he has no time and goes on with his next batch of students.
thats the real pity Renu jee... in Pakistan too, as is elsewhere, we have teachers who feel that 'mentoring' and 'backup' services are not included in the package...
and one interesting thing i wish to share onboard
its common with many masters that when a student comes up with views to discuss, masters start feeling that the student is possibly trying to 'test' his knowledge... while some students really do that, it is to the detriment of the rest that they find the doors of their masters 'closed' when they try to reconcile what they have researched through sources like internet or personal opinions...
Dont we need, at this moment of information age, to have a code of conduct for masters that is sorta manifesto too for everbody who wants coming up with this supreme responsibility ??
take care
salman